@philosophyminis: The #Libet #experiments are some of the most incredible and controversial studies to rattle the philosophical world. They shifted the entire #freewill debate and, according to some people, it even ended it. To understand the Libet experiments, we have to know that there is a particular part of our brain which controls our ‘readiness potential.’ Your readiness potential is what activates before any voluntary decision. So, if you decide to use your thumb to scroll your phone, then your readiness potential acts first, and then your scrolling thumb comes second. So, what was the experiment? Well, Libet got a group of students, and he told them that they had to lift their hand when they wanted. All subjects were told to note the exact time they ‘chose’ to move their hand. It was speculated that the subject's awareness of moving their hand would come at the same time as the readiness potential activated. But this is not what happened at all. The part of the brain responsible would activate 350 milliseconds before they were aware of the fact. This shows that the #brain ‘chose’ to act before the subjects were aware of even choosing. As Libet concluded, ‘voluntary action appears to be an #unconscious cerebral process. Clearly, free will could not be the initiating agent.’ There are some criticisms of Libet, such as how far this ‘readiness potential’ exclusively serves voluntary action. But the criticisms are inconclusive, and it's generally considered to be good #science . So, next time you reach for a biscuit or you smile at a stranger, remember that your brain has already made that decision for you. #choice #philosophy #education

Jonny Thomson
Jonny Thomson
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Friday 06 December 2024 17:02:32 GMT
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spidey1972
spidey1972 :
but wait, I am my brain so I made the decision and those parts of the brain fired up to prep the muscles to do the action. No?
2024-12-06 19:25:09
56
14z.official
ZZ 14th :
The idea that the early activity shows that the decision is made before is merely an interpretation of the experiment and not a fact. It could also be the case the activity shows intentionality etc
2024-12-06 18:55:05
54
realneil3
Neil Sharwood :
Isn't our thinking shuffling and adjusting the weighting that leads to decision making?
2025-01-04 10:12:21
0
epirus_music_lab
epirus_music_lab :
This is interesting, in musical improvisation it's known that there is not enough time to consciously decide what to play. When improvising well, it's like observing someone else
2024-12-10 00:44:03
14
lodestvr
Lodestar :
Hence the importance of visualization and manifestation?
2024-12-07 09:02:47
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urbanperi
Peri Urban :
What happens if the subject decides NOT to raise their hand? That's what free will is.
2025-03-04 12:51:46
1
proffernsworth
Professor Farnsworth :
Part of our self exists in the future and future us made the conscious choice and informed past self to do it. It's how we can string words together without thinking about it. 😏
2024-12-08 20:51:32
1
bong3h
Adam T :
Are we talking into account that conciousness lags behind reality? We experience ‘now’ about 100ms after it has occurred. Also lag in the system of measurement of registering the response?
2024-12-06 18:42:32
11
mrstephensykes2
Stephen Sykes467 :
In AI it is common to have a decision point at which a choice will be made - is it possible that the readiness potential indicates a forthcoming decision point rather than a specific choice
2024-12-07 21:36:04
3
heizrich
țibuman🦥 :
too oversimplified and not enough said about interpretations. also, notably, the "earlier activation" could be overrun/vetoed by the person, i.e consciousness, resulting in no action.
2024-12-07 00:26:50
0
bennclarke475
RaptorBenn :
This assumes the external response has no delay from inception to expression.
2025-01-06 21:29:12
4
tim_236
Tim :
As layman I wouldn't immediately exclude the concept of free will. Just because there are things out of our control doesnt mean, we have no control. It merely states that we are not all controlling
2024-12-06 22:33:45
6
dilladalla
Tally Ho! :
All this means is that the way we define the word *conscious* is too limiting to describe the working of the human mind.
2025-01-02 12:33:03
3
tremours
Tremours :
Or, you are not your thoughts. If I am that which observes the awareness and creates the thoughts, does that happen before or after the brain?
2024-12-13 19:12:41
1
egodamonra
egodamonra :
I pose to you instead that you make the decision first witch makes the hand move at the speed of impulse travel, then it registers that its destination to act was executed. that registration is what we expiance as true acting vs imagined acting.
2024-12-07 01:02:20
1
miller0161
dane miller :
Deep, that is rather very interesting indeed and it would explain and make sense of so much.
2025-02-27 23:01:31
0
randomnadir
randomnadir :
The paradox of free will is the friction between physical determinism and individual agency, and there's so many ways to address it. The more you define your terms the more the paradox goes away.
2025-01-19 14:17:15
0
damo324682
user4901249136379 :
just to put this our! dust the brain delay the thought so it can process it
2025-01-09 19:46:13
0
davesnothere00
Lock :
nearly half a second, that’s a long time
2025-01-22 12:20:41
0
cow_town_special
Cow_town_special :
You should do one on the telepathy tapes
2025-01-13 02:58:31
0
oliverapalmer
oliverapalmer :
surely this ignores the subconscious as part of our total consciousness?
2025-01-10 19:54:44
0
giox167
GioX :
Yup- - perhaps- meditation- may- meet- this part of the brain- yet- our unconcious- remains- free-to will- away💝💝💝
2025-01-19 13:25:59
0
dean.ie
dean.ie :
Wave collapse function a la quantum mechanics.
2024-12-13 23:57:24
0
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