Lyinoptimist
Region: US
Wednesday 16 July 2025 20:55:16 GMT
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KodaThePoet :
That woman has been alive for YEARS!!!! If she says they can't be saved, I BELIEVE HER!!!!
2025-07-16 22:14:34
144
Steffi :
I think people are projecting humanity on the demons cause in modern day we teach that monsters are just misunderstood, like Frankenstein. so now any monster should be complex and given a chance. but thats not the point of demons in Frieren. they don't have humanity, souls, they are animals that evolved to look like humans to hunt better.
2025-07-17 00:54:04
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Yoyodude :
I don’t get it tho. Like what message are the current demons giving us? Right now it’s reading as: some races are just inherently bad. It feels odd cuz they look like ppl. What else are we supposed to get from that? Like the average person.
2025-07-22 21:58:50
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dynasty10000 :
Why would I humanize literal demons lol
2025-07-16 21:12:11
37
Paladin Trev :
Frieren basically explains that demons were monsters who evolved to mimic the true races as their evolutionary strategy to prey upon people. Idk why it’s so hard to get that
2025-07-18 16:20:15
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Raethr, probably :
I have a lot of complicated feelings about Frieren demons, but the most straightforward narrative critique is that I feel that a character who chooses to be an absolute hater is always going to be more compelling than one who is biologically driven to it. Like, the demons have no agency in what they do, so they feel like relatively weak asides from the story that matters.
2025-07-17 01:27:43
10
xnobledeadmanx :
the demons being one note evil antagonists was a lil annoying considering how this series is trying to poise itself. which imo is one that is reflective of the passage of time as well as emotions. ppl are very emotional in frieren to a degree. so demons who appear apathetic and eating humans are just fodder for battle sequences rather than the way the series poses itself as a serious look at emotions and bonds. granted the manga does try to touch on demons and their way of experiencing emotions
2025-07-16 21:20:52
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Zidan James :
They spent a whole episode to why they can’t be 😩😭, people be watching anime with their eyes closed
2025-07-20 22:32:13
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Christopher Joseph :
I think the flaw in that argument is just simply that in the text of the universe it is made explicitly clear on a dozen occasions that the demons are inherently different than all other forms of sentient life, with a predisposition to prey on humans due to humanity’s rampant empathy and pack-bonding. There are other races in-universe and the most intense racism any of them face is generally surprise that they exist. But the demons explicitly lack empathy, quite literally unable to understand cooperation for any reason other than to enable slaughter. They’re sharks who can speak.
2025-07-16 23:54:56
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BeatKiller Awesome :
The way this has been a debate for a long time now is actually annoying, the show literally tells you first hand that these demons are literally no different to wild animals (predators) that have learned certain tactics over time to trick humans (prey) such as putting them into a false sense of safety so that they can kill them.
2025-07-16 21:36:18
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Mmmm….. :
I think my biggest issue with the demons being evil is how that plugs back into the story as a whole. Like you said Frieren is a show about emotional growth and the value of community so having your main character condemn an entire group feels weird writing wise. I don’t think that’s what the writer is going for either. The biggest reason I don’t think they’re evil is because Frieren thinks they are. I think people forget that Frieren isn’t human. The demons are her foils and the foils to elves as a whole. Races that exist in and perceive the world very differently than humans. To me the question isn’t really about redemption but rather an exploration of what the limits are when it comes to co existing with others. Not are they evil. It’s even if they aren’t is co existing possible and is it worth paying the cost to try.
2025-07-19 04:13:42
0
Kyle Frid :
One of the main problems I had with the ways the Demons are handled is that up to that point Frieren had to grow out of ways and beliefs she had ingrained for 100s of years, but with the Demons her unmitigated hatred of them was shown to be 100% justified and everyone else was wrong for doubting her fantasy racism.
2025-07-17 13:24:43
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raviantheravi :
fr fr. also like, frieren really don't be hating all that much. she was about to leave that city and maaaaaybe kill aura...but those demons in the city woulda just been doing what they want.
2025-07-17 00:53:17
18
Ya Boy, Ace :
The Demons being intrinsically evil works for the story Frieren is trying to tell, but there's a slight noncongruity because of the series' focus on interpersonal bonds and emotional development/understanding. For me personally, seeing that the Demons are capable of expressing complex emotions like fear, envy and pride alongside the explanation that they don't raise their offspring gives me the deep rooted thought: "If a newborn demon were raised in a loving, moral family rather than being left to survive alone, would they be good?"
2025-07-17 09:32:35
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Airheaded Aviator :
The flaw of the Demons being simply evil reflects a flaw in the story as a whole, and not because the demons are pure evil. The demons aren't even entirely obstacles are they? When the show outright overts that there are no stakes to the characters. Nah the flaw of the Demons is that they do not challenge the protagonists' character. Frieren as a character isn't challenged in her values past episode 2 imo. After that she's only affirmed in her approaches, for everything, constantly. The Demons being more nuanced on why they're evil could be interesting, challenge her biases. Them being just pure evil could if they were ever a challenge. But no, they're just topping. All stakes are kinda just topping for the characters in a way where they don't really have to be tested.
2025-07-16 23:18:57
2
script_lotus :
I think of them like animals, but not lesser than humans(who are also animals). Most aren’t being mean, just using what tools they have to hunt. Similar to a hunter using an animal call to attract prey.
2025-07-17 11:31:23
2
ElektraAlGhulFrost :
I feel like the demons are mostly a plot device, they're like the Grimm from RWBY and as you said the human antagonists like Ubel are more developed and have much more story that I don't really think about the demons except for maybe Lugner
2025-07-16 21:15:02
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its_fine_time :
I kinda like how in a series built around becoming a better communicator and build deep connections with people, the main antagonistic force uses those same skills to hurt and kill.
2025-07-17 11:42:00
10
KD :
I think it’s interesting to see how Macht lived but he couldn’t change his nature on a fundamental level, on a surface level i think yea but it took literal decades and he was still planning on doing bad stuff
2025-07-16 22:59:41
3
Jarlaxle :
Remember Demon bodies dissappear after they die just like the other monsters in the series
2025-07-17 04:43:20
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Murmurings :
im inclined to disagree, but you made your point super well! the low narrative weight does 100% reduce the impact of the weird fantasy racism of any "inherently evil demons" trope. helps too that the demons aren't especially queer or racially coded (arguably they're 'white' or however that works in japanese supremacist ideologies. nobility feels relevant, given how 'finely' the demons tend to be dressed.) i feel like you could also say that the amorphous nature of the demons & the explicit 'might makes right' hierarchy is less about colonial conceptions of 'savagery' and more about how cycles of violence can render whole classes of people into obstacles for others (e.g. the bourgeoisie's ownership of production makes them structurally demons to us proles) B U T ! the broader context of fantasy racism is too loud, methinks. you just really cannot in good faith (esp. for a japenese audience, members a notably supremacist neoliberal satellite state to the US) create an 'ontologically evil. literally in their blood'-style fantasy race without doing racism. the implication alone is structurally racist, although the author DOES do a very good job mitigating it a lot. id love to see more fantasy follow suit and try to squeeze out as much supremacist ideology from it like frieren did. there's GOTTA be a model of 'evil fantasy race' that subverts this structure, but frieren only comes close imo. ty for always sharing such great perspectives!! i loved this show a lot, easily worth the pacing issues
2025-07-16 21:14:28
7
madm0ch1 :
Guys the LITERAL only difference between a demon and an einsam(the illusion monsters) is demon use their body as the illusion and master other magics. They dont need to be humanized.
2025-07-17 14:00:19
8
brandononline0 :
Everyone wants a redemption arc because zuko was the greatest character ever made. I love zuko but that every villain needs too have some sad backstory train of thought. Has taken over the minds of a lot of creators. Sometimes villains are just evil that’s ok sometimes there the most iconic.
2025-07-17 03:15:30
3
aleksander :
Yeah I wonder why show demonizes Demons lol
2025-07-17 07:43:15
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